The argument to legalize all drugs

[pukaman]

Gateway Drugs.....
All murderers at one time experimented with BREAD. Most crimes are commited with in 12 hrs of eating Bread.
Most Alcoholics got their start with Bread.
Bread could be used to suffocate a child.
Most Spousal abuse occurs within 12 hrs of eating Bread.
Most bread eaters started their slide to addiction with the human breast, making the breast illegal would drastically reduce the gateway factor, chain of events : Breast- Bread- Drugs and Murder.
Oh, that must be what Ashcroft had in mind when he covered the naked breast of the Statue of Justice in his dep't.
I feel safer now.
Don't get me started on the horrible dangers of water and the tragic crimes commited by water drinkers....
We could end all this silly debate just by making thought illegal.
Think of the tax dollars that could be saved by not having different thoughts among the public.
Disagree and go to Jail.......
Now there's a warm thought.......javascript:adds(%22;)%22)
Pukaman

[scummybear]

pukaman said:

It's interesting and amusing to me that people who object to "Socialized Medicine" and Welfare,
have no objection to giving "Corporate Welfare" in the amount of 100 million dollars to Coca Cola to promote Coke in China,as happened a few years ago.
Why doesn't having your tax dollars given to a multi-national corporation to create more sugar addicts burn you up
Drugs are expensive because of Gov't funded price controls under the guise of illegality.
CIA has been importing cocaine and heroin for years and using the profits for their black book operations.
Marijuana would be free if it was legal to grow your own.
Drugs which should be illegal are sugar and alcohol.
Thousands of young people's lives and health will be negatively affected by Sugar caused Diabetes than by all the Drugs combined
.So why isn't sugar outlawed,if the issue is really about Health ?
More innocent kids lives will be ruined by poor diet and poisons in the air, asthma and diabetes etc, than by heroin.
Where is the outcry about that ??
Get real and get the TRUTH....
Pukaman

I would say nice try, but sugar? Please. And the CIA importing heroin and cocaine? Get a grip man. Even Oliver Stoned would have to pause for that one. Your post would make a good "This is your brain on drugs" commercial

[pukaman]

Yes. Sugar.
Search for Obesity on google. usa rate of obesity is over 20% nationwide. over 30% in Hawai'i.
Obesity is 30+ Lbs overweight.

There is a national epidemic of childhood Diabetes.
Kidney failure, blindness, and rotting toes and fingers are some of the fringe benefits of the drug Sugar.

If, the goal of the drug war is to "protect the Children", then lets start with the ones that are responsable for the greatest number of deaths and disease.

Sugar is causing more death and disease than all illegal drugs combined, forever.
More children are suffering from the epidemic of Asthma thanever before.
How about showing some concern for them.
Not one of the cases of Asthma is caused by marijuana or even heroin.

More kids are suffering from lead poisoning than heroin overdoses.

Don't get me wrong, I AM NOT ADVOCATEING DRUG USE..
my point is : Lets look at some of the really dmamaging drugs that are having horrible health effects on our Children.

It's so easy to point an uninformed finger at a boogie man.
Much harder to take a realistic examination of the true causes of disease and poor health.

Believe it or not, you are what you eat. and drink and breathe.
Think about it...

[scummybear]

I think you're still confused about the origins of Diabetes, as I seem to remember responding to a similar thread about the same thing; and I'm still failing to see what in the wide world of sports it has to do with this thread.
Sugar?
Rotten teeth, obesity, and hyperactivity, sure. Diabetes?, No. Relevance to this topic: none.
Asthma? I'm glad to see that its not caused by Heroin or Marijuana, but what does it have to do with this thread?

[pukaman]

Scummybear said:

I think you're still confused about the origins of Diabetes, as I seem to remember responding to a similar thread about the same thing; and I'm still failing to see what in the wide world of sports it has to do with this thread.
Sugar?

What sugar has to do with this thread is that it could be considered a dangerous drug. Check this out:
Rense.com




78 Ways Sugar Can
Ruin Your Health
From Dr. Nancy Appleton's book
'Lick the Sugar Habit'
7-10-4
In addition to throwing off the body's homeostasis, excess sugar may result in a number of other significant consequences. The following is a listing of some of sugar's metabolic consequences from a variety of medical journals and other scientific publications.
Ê
1. Sugar can suppress the immune system.
2. Sugar can upset the body's mineral balance.
3. Sugar can cause hyperactivity, anxiety, concentration difficulties, and crankiness in children.
4. Sugar can cause drowsiness and decreased activity in children.
5. Sugar can adversely affect children's school grades.
6. Sugar can produce a significant rise in triglycerides.
7. Sugar contributes to a weakened defense against bacterial infection.
8. Sugar can cause kidney damage.
9. Sugar can reduce helpful high density cholesterol (HDLs).
10. Sugar can promote an elevation of harmful cholesterol (LDLs).
11. Sugar may lead to chromium deficiency.
12. Sugar can cause copper deficiency.
13. Sugar interferes with absorption of calcium and magnesium.
14. Sugar may lead to cancer of the breast, ovaries, prostate, and rectum.
15. Sugar can cause colon cancer, with an increased risk in women.
16. Sugar can be a risk factor in gall bladder cancer.
17. Sugar can increase fasting levels of blood glucose.
18. Sugar can weaken eyesight.
19. Sugar raises the level of a neurotransmitter called serotonin, which can narrow blood vessels.
20. Sugar can cause hypoglycemia.
21. Sugar can produce an acidic stomach.
22. Sugar can raise adrenaline levels in children.
23. Sugar can increase the risk of coronary heart disease.
24. Sugar can speed the aging process, causing wrinkles and grey hair.
25. Sugar can lead to alcoholism.
26. Sugar can promote tooth decay.
27. Sugar can contribute to weight gain and obesity.
28. High intake of sugar increases the risk of Crohn's disease and ulcerative colitis.
29. Sugar can cause a raw, inflamed intestinal tract in persons with gastric or duodenal ulcers.
30. Sugar can cause arthritis.
31. Sugar can cause asthma.
32. Sugar can cause candidiasis (yeast infection).
33. Sugar can lead to the formation of gallstones.
34. Sugar can lead to the formation of kidney stones.
35. Sugar can cause ischemic heart disease.
36. Sugar can cause appendicitis.
37. Sugar can exacerbate the symptoms of multiple sclerosis.
38. Sugar can indirectly cause hemorrhoids.
39. Sugar can cause varicose veins.
40. Sugar can elevate glucose and insulin responses in oral contraception users.
41. Sugar can lead to periodontal disease.
42. Sugar can contribute to osteoporosis.
43. Sugar contributes to saliva acidity.
44. Sugar can cause a decrease in insulin sensitivity.
45. Sugar leads to decreased glucose tolerance.
46. Sugar can decrease growth hormone.
47. Sugar can increase total cholesterol.
48. Sugar can increase systolic blood pressure.
49. Sugar can change the structure of protein causing interference with protein absorption.
50. Sugar causes food allergies.
51. Sugar can contribute to diabetes.
52. Sugar can cause toxemia during pregnancy.
53. Sugar can contribute to eczema in children.
54. Sugar can cause cardiovascular disease.
55. Sugar can impair the structure of DNA.
56. Sugar can cause cataracts.
57. Sugar can cause emphysema.
58. Sugar can cause atherosclerosis.
59. Sugar can cause free radical formation in the bloodstream.
60. Sugar lowers the enzymes' ability to function.
61. Sugar can cause loss of tissue elasticity and function.
62. Sugar can cause liver cells to divide, increasing the size of the liver.
63. Sugar can increase the amount of fat in the liver.
64. Sugar can increase kidney size and produce pathological changes in the kidney.
65. Sugar can overstress the pancreas, causing damage.
66. Sugar can increase the body's fluid retention.
67. Sugar can cause constipation.
68. Sugar can cause myopia (nearsightedness).
69. Sugar can compromise the lining of the capillaries.
70. Sugar can cause hypertension.
71. Sugar can cause headaches, including migraines.
72. Sugar can cause an increase in delat, alpha and theta brain waves, which can alter the mind's ability to think clearly.
73. Sugar can cause depression.
74. Sugar can increase insulin responses in those consuming high-sugar diets compared to low sugar diets.
75. Sugar increases bacterial fermentation in the colon.
76. Sugar can cause hormonal imbalance.
77. Sugar can increase blood platelet adhesiveness which increases risk of blood clots.
78. Sugar can increase the risk of Alzheimer Disease.






Ê<br>

[pukaman]

Ê
REFERENCES to the previous article on sugar
Ê
A. Sanchez, et al. "Role of Sugars in Human Neutrophilic Phagocytosis."American Journal of Clinical Nutrition, November 1973, pp. 1180-1184.
F. Couizy, C. Keen, M.E.Gershwin, and F.P. Mareschi.Nutritional Implications of the Interaction between Minerals. Progressive Food and Nutrition Science 17, 1933, 65-87.
J. Goldman, et al. "Behavioral Effects of Sucrose on Preschool Children," Journal of Abnormal Child Psychology. 14 1986 565-577.
D. Behar, J. Rapoport, Berg C., Adams, and M. Cornblat. "Sugar Testing with Children Considered Behaviorally Sugar Reactive. Nutritional Behavior 1 1984 277-288
Alexander Schausss. Diet, Crime and Delinquecny (Berkeley, CA: Parker House 1981)
S. Scanto and John Yudkin. "The Effect of Dietary Sucronse on Blood Lipids, Serum, Insulin, Platelet Adhesiveness and Body Weith in Human Volunteers. Postgraduate Medicine Jmournal 45: 1969 602-607
W. Rinsdor, E. Cheraskin, and R. Ramsay. "Sucrose Neutrophlic Phagocystosis and Resistance to Disease. Dental Survey 52. 12 1976 46-48.
J. Yudkin, S. Kang, and K. Bruckdorfer. "Effects of High Dietary Sugar." British Journal of Medicine 281, November 22, 1980,p. 1396.
Ibid.
Lewis GF , Steiner G Acute effects of insulin in the control of VLDL production in humans. Implications for theinsulin-resistant state. Department of Medicine, University of Toronto, Canada. Diabetes Care 1996 Apr;19(4):390-3 R. Pamplona, M.J. Bellmunt, M. Portero, and J. Prat. "Mechanisms of Glycation in Atherogenesis." Medical Hypotheses 40, 1990, pp. 174-181.
A. Kozlovsky, et al. "Effects of Diets High in Simple Sugars on Urinary Chromium Losses." Metabolism 35, June 1986, pp. 515-518.
M. Fields, et al. "Effect of Copper Deficiency on Metabolism and Mortality in Rats Fed Sucrose or Starch Diets." Journal of Clinical Nutrition 113, 1983, pp. 1335-1345.
"Sugar and Prostate Cancer." Health Express, October, 1982, p. 41.
R.M. Bostick, J.D. Potter, L.H. Kushi, et al. "Sugar, Meat, and Fat Intake, and Non-dietary Risk Factors for Colon Cancer Incidence in Iowa Women." Cancer Causes and Controls 5, 1994, pp. 38-52.
Clara Moerman, et al. "Dietary Sugar Intake in the Etiology of Biliary Tract Cancer." lnternational Journal of Epidemiology 22, No.2, 1993, pp.207-214.
J. Kelsay, et al. "Diets High in Glucose or Sucrose and Young Women." American Journal of Clinical Nutrition 27, 1974, pp. 926-936.
J. Lemann. "Evidence That Glucose Ingestion Inhibits Net Renal Tubular Reabsorption of Calcium and Magnesium." Journal of Clinical Nutrition 70, 1967, pp. 236-245.
H. Ed Taub, ed. "Sugar Weakens Eyesight." VM Newsletter 5, May 1986.
Richard Wurtman. University of California, Berkeley, Newsletter 6, No. 3, December 1989, pp.4-5.
William Dufty. Sugar Blues. (New York: Warner Books, 1975.)
Ibid.
J. Lewis. "Health Briefings." Fort Worth Star Telegram, June 11, 1990.
Katz RJ , Ratner RE , Cohen RM , Eisenhower E , Verme D Are insulin and proinsulin independent risk markers for premature coronary artery disease ? Department of Medicine, Division of Cardiology, George Washington University School of Medicine, Washington, DC 20037, USA. Diabetes 1996 Jun;45(6):736-41
Annette T. Lee, and Anthony Cerami. "The Role of Glycation in Aging." Annals of the New York Academy of Science 663, pp. 6370. D.G. Dyer, et al. "Accumulation of Maillard Reaction Products in Skin Collagen in Diabetes and Aging." Journal of Clinical Investigation 91, No. 6, June 1993, pp. 421-422.
E. Abrahamson, and A. Peget. Body, Mind and Sugar. (New York: Avon, 1977.)
W. Glinsmann, H. Irausquin, and K. Youngmee. Report from FDA's Sugar Task Force, 1986: Evaluation of Health Aspects of Sugars Contained in Carbohydrate Sweeteners. (Washington, DC: Center for Food Safety and Applied Nutrition, 1986, p. 39.)
H. Keen, B. Thomas, R. Jarrett, and J. Fuller. "Nutrient Intake, Adiposity, and Diabetes." British Medical Journal 6164, No. 1, March 10, 1979, pp. 655-658.
T. Cleave. Sweet and Dangerous. (New York: Bantam Books, 1974, pp. 28-43.) B.G. Persson, et al. "Diet and Inflammatory Bowel Disease." Epidemiology 3, No. 1, January 1992, pp. 47-51.
T. Cleave. Sweet and Dangerous. (New York: Bantam Books, 1974, pp. 157-159.)
L. Darlington, Ramsey, and Mansfield. "Placebo-Controlled, Blind Study of Dietary Manipulation Therapy in Rheumatoid Arthritis." Lancet 8475, No. 1, February 6,1986, pp.236-238.
Lawrence Powers. "Sensitivity: You React to What You Eat." Los Angeles Times, February 12, 1985.
W. Crook. The Yeast Connection. (Jackson, TN: Professional Books, 1984.)
K. Heaton. "The Sweet Road to Gallstones." British Medical Journal 288, April 14, 1984, pp. 1103-1104.
N.J. Blacklock. "Sucrose and Idiopathic Renal Stone." Nutrition and Health 5, No. 1-2, 1987, pp. 9-17.
J. Yudkin. "Dietary Fat and Dietary Sugar." Lancet, August 29, 1964, pp. 478-479.
T. Cleave. The Saccharine Disease. (New Canaan, CT: Keats Publishing, 1974, p. 125.)
S. Erlander. "The Cause and Cure of Multiple Sclerosis." The Disease to End Disease 1, No. 3, March 3, 1979, pp. 59-63.
T. Cleave. The Saccharine Disease. (New Canann, CT: Keats Publishing, 1974, p. 45.)
T. Cleave, and G. Campbell. Diabetes, Coronary Thrombosis and the Saccharine Disease. (Bristol, England: John Wright and Sons, 1960.)
K. Behall. "Influence of Estrogen Content of Oral Contraceptives and Consumption of Sucrose on Blood Parameters." DiseaseAbstracts International B. 43, 1982, p. 1437.
W. Glinsmann, H. Irausquin, and K. Youngmee. Report from FDA's Sugar Task Force, 1986: Evaluation of Health Aspects of Sugars Contained in Carbohydrate Sweeteners. (Washington, DC: Center for Food Safety and Applied Nutrition, 1986, p. 39.)
Nancy Appleton. Lick the Sugar Habit Bones. (Garden City Park, NY: "Reaction of Monosaccharides Avery Publishing Group, 1989, with Protein: Possible Evolupp. 36-38.)
Schrezenmeir J III.Hyperinsulinemia, hyperproinsulinemia and insulin resistance in the metabolic syndrome. Medical Clinic, Johannes-Gutenberg University, Mainz, Germany. Experientia 1996 May 15;52(5):426-32
H. Beck-Nelson., O. Pedersen, and Sorensen Schwartz. "Effects of Diet on the Cellular Insulin Binding and the Insulin Sensitivity in Young Healthy Subjects." Diabetes 15, 1978, pp. 289-296.
H. Keen, B. Thomas, R. Jarrett, and J. Fuller. "Nutritional Factors in Diabetes Mellitus." J. Yudkin, ed. Applied Science, 1977, pp. 89-108.
L. Gardner, and S. Reiser. "Effects of Dietary Carbohydrate on Fasting Levels of Human Growth Hormone and Cortisol." Proceedings of the Society for Experimental Biology and Medicine 169, 1982, pp. 3640.
S. Reiser. "Effects of Dietary Sugars on Metabolic Risk Factors Associated with Heart Disease." Nutritional Health 3,1985, pp. 203-216
R. Hodges, and T. Rebello. "Carbohydrates and Blood Pressure." Annals of Internal Medicine 98, 1983, pp. 838-841.Insulin, hypertension and antihypertensive drugs in elderly patients: the Rotterdam Study. Stolk RP , Hoes AW , Pols HA , Hofman A , de Jong PT , Lamberts SW , Grobbee DE Department of Epidemiology and Biostatistics, Erasmus University Medical School, Rotterdam,The Netherlands. J Hypertens 1996 Feb;14(2):237-42
J. Simmons. "Is the Sand of Time Sugar?" Longevity, June 1990, pp. 49-53. F. Bunn, and P.J. Higgins. Significance." Science 213, July 10, 1981, pp. 222-224. Anthony Cerarni, Helen Vlassara, and Michael Brownlee. "Glucose and Aging." Scientific American, May 1987, p.90.
Nancy Appleton. Healthy Bones. (Garden City Park, NY: Avery Publishing Group, 1991.)
Jenkins DJ , Jenkins ALNutrition principles and diabetes. A role for "lente carbohydrate"? Department of Nutritional Sciences, University of Toronto, Ontario,Canada. Diabetes Care 1995 Nov;18(11):1491-8"Sucrose Induces Diabetes in Cats." Federal Protocol 6, No. 97, 1974.
T. Cleave. The Saccharine Disease. (New Canaan, CT: Keats Publishing, 1974, pp. 132-133.)
Ibid.
Ruth L. Caccaro, and J. Stamle. "Relationship of Postload Plasma Glucose to Mortality with a Follow-Up." Diabetic Care 15, No. 10, October 1992.
Annette T. Lee, and Anthony Cerami. "Modifications of Proteins and Nucleic Acids by Reducing Sugars: Possible Role in Aging." Handbook of the Biology of Aging. (New York: Academic Press, 1990.)
Suresh I.S. Rattan, Anastasia Derventzi, and Brian Clark. "Protein Synthesis, Post-translational Modifications, and Aging." Annals of the New York Academy of Sciences 663, 1992, pp. 48- 62.
V.M. Monnier. "Nonenzymatic Glycosylation, the Maillard Reaction and the Aging Process." Journal of Gerontology 45, No. 4, 1990, pp. 105-110.
R Pamplona, M.J. Bellmunt, M. Portero, and J. Prat "Mechanisms of Glycation in Atherogenesis." Medical Hypotheses 40, 1990, pp.174-181.
Ibid.

[scummybear]

Oh hell, I give up!

Ok, LETS BAN SUGAR!

SUGAR IS EVIL!

HELP SAVE US FROM SUGAR!




You can choose any substance known to the universe and find thousands of ways it can kill you (most of which are unsubstantiated)

I would still like to know what relevance it has to the thread.

[pukaman]

the relevance is this:
Sugar is a Drug with harmfull effects. I don't want my tax $ going to pay for the Socialist Health Care for someone who uses a harmfull drug, destroys their health and expects me to pay for it...
Point two : the wrong drugs are illegal.

Millions of people's lives are being destroyed by the well documented effects of sugar.
Why is sugar legal, when an herb like marijuana, which has no record of death by overdose in 5000 yrs, is illegal ??

Could this have anything to do with the propaganda campaign of the pharmie cos., Dow,etc of the 30's ?

Can any one prove that MJ is more harmfull than Sugar ?
I show ample proof of the harm of sugar. You have the same amount of docs. showing the harm of MJ ?

Presidential panels to investigate MJ in the past have reccomended the use/decriminalization, benefits. Which were of course ignored by the Pres.

Once again, Science is now match for Political Opinion.....

thats my point

[scummybear]

Sugar is a Drug with harmfull effects. I don't want my tax $ going to pay for the Socialist Health Care for someone who uses a harmfull drug, destroys their health and expects me to pay for it...
Point two : the wrong drugs are illegal.

So now you don't want your tax money spent to help people with diseases. Hmm, I'm confused.
But you wouldn't mind your tax money to help someone who abuses and destroys their body because they won't put down the Zag-nuts?

Millions of people's lives are being destroyed by the well documented effects of sugar.
Why is sugar legal, when an herb like marijuana, which has no record of death by overdose in 5000 yrs, is illegal ??

This particular point
is ridiculous. We couldn't live without "sugar". (in the form of carbohydrates) .People can certainly abuse food, just like anything else, but a bag of Snickers bars never caused anyone to careen across an interstate in a motor vehicle and kill someone ( at least not that I know of )

Can any one prove that MJ is more harmfull than Sugar ?
I show ample proof of the harm of sugar. You have the same amount of docs. showing the harm of MJ ?

I don't even need to show you the documentation of the ill effects of marijuana on the liver, kidneys, BRAIN, etc. . . It is a drug. Not "an herb dude"

You show ample proof only that stuffing your face with Moon-pies and swilling Ne-hi's will eventually kill you.

[disenter512]

Ok you went from talking about making drugs legal to this crap about suger. I thought this was a site deticated to bad spelling and great debate. so let us get back on track.

Most of the time I argue that drugs should not be legal. the answer I get most is beer and wine are drugs so is tabacco. Ok I agree. Beer and cigs kill and cause harmful side-effects true. ONe thing people tend to forget is that for hundreds of years men have been using tabacco and beer. It is a tradition and in time and space tradition is hard to break and condem, now new drugs are not a tradition they have no president and are not going to be accepted by the masses if they are illegl but if they were to be legal more people would try them. We in the US have a big problem already, do we really want to ad to it?

[Essences]

hello, I happened upon this site when doing research for an argument I have to write in my compostion class in favor of legalizing cocaine to the readers of reader's digest. This was a rather difficult task for me to preform because I knew very little on the issue and tend to be in favor of the war on drugs. However I believe I managed to complete my assigned task very well and even give myself a few things to think about. My research led me to the discover that Cocaine was used for a very long time with very little problem, and that the US mainly made it illegal because they feared that minorities who used it were more likely to rebel. No other nations had problems with high ammounts of addiction and really so long as a reasonable ammount is take its relatively harmless. Problems started when higher doses were taken in more harmful ways *ie injecting or snorting* Cocaine was used by many historical figures such as Winston Churchill, Queen Victoria, Ernest Shackleton, Rober Louis Stevens, and maybe Shakespeare. Sir Arthur Conan Doyle's Sherlock Holmes smoked it. Freud endorsed it. It can be used to relieve pain, numb surfaces, cure morphine addiction, relieve depression, clear the mind, and give a positive attitude. Also I feel that as others have said in this thread, crime rates would go down, people who have ODed are more likely to get help, and the government could tax it or whatever and make money off it that way rather than the way the CIA did back in 1979. Animals wouldn't be stuffed with the stuff to smuggle it and wouldn't get sick. And police and feds could dedicate their time to more pressing issues since the need for smugglers and crimes committed in order to obtain drugs would be far less frequent. I don't know that I'm saying legalizing it would be a good thing, I know there could be a lot of really bad reprocussions of doing it. Mostly I think the US as a whole is far to over indulgent of any substance to use it responsibly, legal or not, although illegal ones seem to hold special interests simply because they are illegal.

Also, relating to the previous comments on sugar being a cause of such a large increase in certain deseases. I don't despute that sugar, like many things, is an abused substance in the US and it probably is making some people sick, I do however feel that a more likely cause of the increase in problems like asthma and diabeties would probably be due to the fact that people who suffer from it already are, thanks to medicine, living fuller lives and reproducing more. . Which as we know leads to more people with the genes for these problems. Face it, medicines are messing up natural selection so weaker genes are allowed to show up more often in our offspring. I don't mean to say thats a bad thing, its simply a fact. Thanks for your time.

[Essences]

um. .does this board filter 'bad' words. .and if so did it filter the word assigned. .or did I really write foot igned. .


- modified- what the. .it says it here but I can't modify it to read assigned up there. .weird. .

[scummybear]

My research led me to the discover that Cocaine was used for a very long time with very little problem,

You may need to do a little more research. The problems were there, they just weren't attributable to cocaine back then. There wasn't a very good understanding of addicition, and believe me, users of cocaine had problems.

and that the US mainly made it illegal because they feared that minorities who used it were more likely to rebel.

Interesting. Jesse Jackson would have us believe that whites use it to keep minorities from rebelling.

No other nations had problems with high ammounts of addiction and really so long as a reasonable ammount is take its relatively harmless. Problems started when higher doses were taken in more harmful ways *ie injecting or snorting*

You've just described addiction here, which is the whole problem. Cocaine was just as addicting then as it is now. It was harder to get then, which may be the reason for the percieved decreased number of "problems", however, you're advocating making it easier to get. Hmmmmm.

Freud endorsed it.

Sure he did. He was addicted to it.

It can be used to relieve pain, numb surfaces, cure morphine addiction, relieve depression, clear the mind, and give a positive attitude.

Paradoxically, you'll find that with the exception of it being used as a topical anesthetic, it worsens the problems that you've mentioned above, after only temporarily relieving the symptoms. The painful problems keep coming back, unless more of the drug is used; then more must be used, and more, and more, and so the cycle continues. . .

Also I feel that as others have said in this thread, crime rates would go down, people who have ODed are more likely to get help, and the government could tax it or whatever and make money off it that way

And as others have said in this thread, crime rates would go up. You would have only taken away the supply side problem, and not the demand. People will continue to have to find a way to pay for the stuff, Increasing the availability of a substance responsible for impairing thinking and judgement is not going to have a positive effect on the crime rate. You can use the alcohol argument here if you want, but I believe that it takes on a new meaning to tell someone to snort responsibly.

How is someone who has over-dosed have a higher likelyhood of getting help because cocaine is legal?

On the tax comment:
How much tax money do you think will be spent (in comparison) on government drug-rehab programs for children as well as adults for their rampant cocaine addiction problems??
How much will be spent on police man power, to handle the inevitable increase in crime, since it will now be "OK" to use cocaine? Because no one is going to say how much you can use, or in what circumstances.

Face it, medicines are messing up natural selection so weaker genes are allowed to show up more often in our offspring.

Medicines sort of like, uh, say, cocaine?

[Essences]

I would have to conceed on most of those points, but then I do not advocate the use of drugs and wouldn't fight very hard to legalize any of them, I merely had to write an arguement supporting them for class with very limited time to get well associated with the issues involved and little information as to what exactly I was trying to achieve other than the 'legalization of cocaine' which in my mind could mean any number of things. I do appreciate your critique however of my arguments as I may or may not have to address those weaknesses in the class. While I wrote it I had difficulties because often I disagreed with what I wrote, whether I had solid facts that pointed otherwise or not, but I did what I had to. But thanks again as they were a useful insight to issues I am not clear on anyways. And I realize when I wrote it I put such and such was "my feelings" well I was lazy and pasted a lot of it out of my actual argument so please disregard that.

If your interested in my true feelings on these issues. .well I don't see the point in legalizing it for medicinal purposes when we have so many 'safer' alternatives. Not to mention my opinion of medicine is sort of skewed. .I wouldn't say I'm with the people who say medicines are evil but they do have their pros and cons. .

as far as crime and drugs goes. .well. .there doesn't appear to be any readily available solution to this problem and those that are available will in the long run not really solve anything with out creating equal problems and sending the same if not more money on them.

Do I believe that drugs are dangerous and alter ones mind and make them do things they normally wouldn't? Hell yes. It's been proven how chemicals in the brain being altered by drugs or anything else makes for some severe changes in personality. Mostly I think its wrong because when someones not in their right mind, and sometimes even when they are, they often enfringe or totally walk all over the rights of others and endanger them. If taking drugs didn't 'harm' others aside from emotionally due to seeing a loved one use the stuff, and mostly only affected the user, I probably wouldn't care. If they want to mess themselves up fine, unfortunately it does affect others in more than that one way and that's the biggest reason I am thankful that drugs are illegal.

Oh and as for the minority bit. I do believe that the government used that in order to get more people to agree to make drugs illegal. The government often uses fear, propoganda and anything else they can to get what they want. I don't believe that they made drugs illegal, at least originally, because of issues with health but their exact reason I wouldn't know either. I've read that some feel it just had to do with appereance. .don't know. .Also I do believe that the government has and might still use profits from illegal substances.

I don't have solutions for these problems, since they are rooted primarily in greed and self service these kinds of problems will likely always be around. And I know I can't make anyone else see things my way, and I would never wish to force my views upon others. But I do enjoy expressing certain thoughts and values and hearing others in return on an intelligent basis (which would be why I'm here), and possibly even adjusting my own when I hear something that appeals to me or need to take up a new defense against things I hadn't considered.

on a slightly different note but still linking to drugs in a way. . the site where I got a lot of my information from had a, to me, rather disturbing tendency to allude to a time when the hedonic treadmill (the thing in our central nervous system that they say makes us crash so hard after a high) would no longer be a problem for us and we'd all live blissfull lives, more blissfull than drugs temporarily make us, thanks to genetic engineering. .I don't wish to sound like some sort of religous freak or something but I dont' think humans should be free of suffering, I think its a dangerous and stupid concept that someone who doesn't like facing reality supports, which relates back to drugs in that I feel taking in many cases is just a way to not deal with problems and thats not a good thing. I don't even like antidepressants much because I think it just, in cases like when a loved one dies, makes the healing process take longer by putting it off with drugs. Anyways I know I sorta drifted from the main topic a little so forgive me.


Oh and before I forget, would you mind if I were to quote you in my class in the event that I do need to talk about weaknesses in my argument or how people with opposing views would respond to my arguement?

[pukaman]

I enjoyed reading your thoughts on drugs Ess.

"And I know I can't make anyone else see things my way, and I would never wish to force my views upon others."

Then how can you advocate making something illegal ? Isn't that the same
thing ?

"more blissfull than drugs temporarily make us, thanks to genetic engineering."

This is the most frightening sentance I've read in a long time.
How can anyone fear drugs, yet even consider GENETIC MUTATION as a means of ANYTHING, let alone mental health ?

The negative effects, as well as the positive, of natural medicinal plants, (which is where "drugs" come from), have been known for centuries.

Despite the fantastic claims of the Gene Mutation Co.s, relatively very little
is known about the effects of inter-species gene-combining.

I'd rather have a pound of coke shoved up my nose than a molecule of a gene mutated substance that NO LONG TERM STUDIES HAVE BEEN CONDUCTED ON.
And short term ones are having many drastic failures.

Pharmies are developing corn that has been mutated to produce pharmaceutical drugs of many types. Check out the spread of GMO's pollen and contamination of neighboring plants. It's happening everywhere they have "EXPERIMENTED".
"
YOU AND YOUR CHILDREN AND THEIR CHILDREN ARE THE "TEST CASES"
OF THE GEMETIC MUTATION EXPERIMENTS.

Dioxin hasa been shown to be a genetic mutator.That's what makes it an effective herbicide. Tons of this poison, which is toxic in 3 parts per TRILLION, have been put into the air, earth, water, and food.

Now "scientists" are telling us they have found the "GENETIC" causes for several "DISEASES".

Is there a relationship between tons of mutagens and "genetic" diseases ?

Are YOU willing to be the "Test case" ?
No ?

Well you already have been.

Whats all this got to do with drugs ?

Propaganda and fear is the bread and butter of the "Drug War", and the tool of the Social Planners.

Drug War is used as a smoke screen to cover the more important issues and causes of a failed and sick society.

Would so many people choose to be victims of drugs if their lives were a little more hopefull to begin with?

What of improving conditions that contribute to lives of hopelessness, poverty, and oppression ?
If drugs are an escape tool, why not improve those conditions that lead/force people into escaping to begin with.

The problem with the war on drugs is that nothing is done to improve the underlieng causes or provide humane treatment.

Jails and prisons do NOTHING to improve the lives and hopes of anyone.
It does improve the stock portfolio of the Prison Industry and the Police State.

More than enuff for now