Fly the friendly skies!

[MO]

Fly the friendly skies!
www.whoohoo.net/pilot/index.htm

Make sure you have your sound turned on!

[rush22]

what happens if those armor-piercing bullets pierce not the body armor of terrorists (err how did that get on board), but the body of the plane?

[frankiegoestostoke]

What if the terrorists overpower the flight wardens and seize the guns? Surely the last thing you would want on board a plane post 911 would be a gun, no matter whose hands its in?

[scummybear]

Might have been a different story pre-911, don't you think? Seems to me it would have been worth the risk, considering the circumstances.

[MO]

Maybe they should issue each passenger a .357 upon boarding the plane. Let the passengers keep each other in line.

It seems to work on the ground. Places that allow their citizen their constitutional right to carry a concealed weapon generally have less crime.

[rush22]

No, only at most a .22 you can't have people blowing holes in the plane.

Places that allow their citizen their constitutional right to carry a concealed weapon generally have less crime

Ha. I'd like to see *that* statistic.

[scummybear]

ron.dotson.net/statistics/concealedcarrystates.htm

[rush22]

Doesn't Texas allow concealed carry?

[rush22]

More importantly (I mean, I might be wrong about Texas), the statistic is rather useless because it is not being compared to anything. Many factors influence crime rates. What if Utah just has a lower crime rate anyway? Or what if D.C. has a higher crime rate anyway?

If you look at the change in crime rates when gun laws are modified, then you will find that states that relax their gun laws have an increase in crime, and states that make new gun laws see their crime rates decrease.

Between 1992 and 1998, the robbery rate in strict and no issue states fell 44% while the robbery rate for the 11 states with liberal CCW laws during this entire period dropped 24%. Nationally, the robbery rate fell 37%

...robbery has declined twice as quickly in states with strict licensing or that do not allow concealed carrying at all than in states with lax CCW systems. If carrying concealed weapons reduces crime, it would be expected that the greatest effects would be seen on crimes that most often occur between strangers in public places, such as robbery.

www.bradycampaign.org/facts/research/?page=conctruth&menu=gvr

[scummybear]

My data is provided by the FBI crime stats. Yours is from the "the Brady campaign"

Hmmmm. . .

Think your's might be a little biased?

[rush22]

Yeah yeah, I only did a quick search. My point is that your info is being misinterpreted. You can't compare crime rates and gun control laws in the way they are compared on that page and get the result that "gun control = higher crime rates," because you're looking at the wrong set of data to come to that conclusion.

[scummybear]

rush22 said:

Yeah yeah, I only did a quick search. My point is that your info is being misinterpreted. You can't compare crime rates and gun control laws in the way they are compared on that page and get the result that "gun control = higher crime rates," because you're looking at the wrong set of data to come to that conclusion.

You asked for statistics, and I provided them. Clear and concise.
What in the hell else do you want?

You know,
You and Frankie would argue about the smell of a turd, rather than coming to the logical conclusion that it just stinks. Logic doesn't seem to apply to you for some reason. But that's a given.

The fact of the matter is, the liberals are trying to tear down society as we know it by jacking around with the constitution; but the 2nd amendment rights won't be changed just because you think that guns are bad. Personal accountabilty means nothing to you with regard this issue, because it's not about guns; it's about the quest to rob people of their personal freedoms.

[rush22]

This has the stats from the FBI.

"According to the Federal Bureau of Investigation’s Uniform Crime Reports, from 1996 to 1997 the nation’s overall crime rate dropped 3.2%, from 5086.6 to 4922.7 crimes per 100,000 population. More telling, crime fell faster in states that have strict carrying concealed weapons (CCW) laws or that don’t allow the carrying of concealed weapons at all than in states which have lax CCW laws. This strongly suggests that, contrary to the arguments made by the National Rifle Association and others, states should not make it easier for citizens to carry concealed weapons in order to reduce crime"

"In the 29 states that have lax CCW laws (where law enforcement must issue CCW licenses to almost all applicants), the crime rate fell 2.1%, from 5397.0 to 5285.1 crimes per 100,000 population from 1996 to 1997.
During the same time period, in the 21 states and the District of Columbia withstrict carry laws or which don’t allow the carrying of concealed weapons at all, the crime rate fell 4.4%, from 4810.5 to 4599.9 crimes per 100,000 population. The decline in the crime rate of strict licensing and no-carry states was 2.1 times that of states with lax CCW systems, indicating that there are more effective ways to fight crime than to encourage more people to carry guns. "

www.texansforgunsafety.org/articles/archives/statsrefute.htm

[rush22]

I'm not here to rob your freedoms, I'm just pointing out that the argument that crime is lower in states with ccw is a misinterpretation of the statistic. It's a bad argument.

[rush22]

If you still don't get it, here is an example:

In Canada, all provinces do not allow ccw. The crime rate in Canada is much lower than all of the US. Does that mean gun control does work? What about cities? Crime is higher in bigger cities even if there is gun control. The statistic gives the false impression that ccw states have lower crime rates because of ccw, when in fact, it is just as likely that they have lower crime rates for other reasons like population and other demographics.