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Post by chaMur on Nov 25, 2004 21:45:56 GMT -5
All i've got to say is that you're a man. You should have no say whether a woman(who u dont even know ) should have a baby or not. That should be reason enough.
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Post by MO on Nov 26, 2004 2:20:45 GMT -5
All I can say to that is that I'm not a man, but to say that a man's opinion is irrelevant to this discussion is to have been sucked into the oxygen free vortex of illogical, feminazi, nonsense talk.
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Post by chaMur on Nov 26, 2004 9:32:33 GMT -5
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Post by MO on Nov 26, 2004 11:08:25 GMT -5
Your link doesn't work. Regardless, I'm sure you can find others on the net with such a vacant opinion. Doesn't mean much. I'd never be convinced there is any logic in such empty rhetoric.
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Post by Ian on Nov 26, 2004 14:51:40 GMT -5
Women aren't allowed in combat, yet female politicians influence policy decisions all the time. There are plenty of lesbians who don't have children, and never plan to, who are activists in the pro-choice movement. Plus, like MO said, there are millions of pro-life women. Your argument is a joke. Thanks for the laugh.
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Post by Coben on Dec 20, 2004 9:09:24 GMT -5
Well, it's a potential tangent, but for me related.
Most forms of warfare include abortions. Usually the mother is killed along with the unborn fetus. Sure it is hard to wage war while not killing unborn fetuses, but who said following God's rules was going to be easy.
Nuclear weapons, if used, necessitate the killing of innocent people, unborn children in their mothers' wombs, along with whatever military targets. How many of you are willing to take a stand against military action that stands a good chance of killing unborn children?
And why not?
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Post by Ian on Dec 20, 2004 10:59:09 GMT -5
The willful killing of a fetus?
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Post by MO on Dec 20, 2004 15:37:56 GMT -5
The whole world is not going to build a campfire, join hands and sing KumBaYah, so your war analogy is just stupid. There is nothing compassionate about sitting in front of a computer, wishing for world peace like a beauty pageant contestant with two brain cells, while defending the slaughter of children in the name of convenience. No matter how successfully you sell that noise to yourself, I bet few will buy it here. Sell crazy somewhere else.
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Post by Ian on Dec 20, 2004 18:28:49 GMT -5
Hey! Don't insult Beauty Queens, most of them have at least three brain cells. *Generalization*
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Post by yaamerica on May 23, 2005 9:58:57 GMT -5
So women shouldn't be allowed to abort the results of consensual sex because "they got themselves into it," and now they shouldn't be allowed to abort the results of rape either because it's not the fetus' fault that its dad's a rapist? Are you mad? Just when, oh when, does what the woman wants come into this? Apparently neither when the sex was consensual, nor when it was coerced. Do you EVER believe a woman should be able to put her foot down and say, that's enough! Does she ever get a choice? All I can say is THANK THE POWERS THAT BE that you and your fanatical kind will NEVER have power to dictate what happens after a rape. Oops! I take that back. You might, if you convince 95% of the population to think as you do. Then we'll officially be living in the Christian version of Afghanistan or Saudi Arabia. Are you some kind of retard? Yeah, it's awful to have to deal with something you didn't want and blah blah, but theirs always the adoption option, and giving the child to parents who may want a child and can't have one. The mother really doesn't have to raise the child. Although most cases of abortion aren't rape. Most are just morons who decide to hop into bed with someone who just broke up with them a week later. Way to search for "good" guys to date.
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Post by midcan5 on Feb 4, 2007 11:41:59 GMT -5
"House" this past week covered the issue of rape and life and death and suffering and identity and meaning and abortion. I usually pick on Fox (faux) news but some of their programs touch on some tough issues. This particular show was amazingly thoughtful.
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Post by alaskansheilah on Oct 18, 2008 13:41:37 GMT -5
It may be instictual to "fall in love" with the child one carries, but it is also instictual to want rid of all trace of the ATTACK rape poses. Women will INSTICTUALLY attempt their own abortions in the case of rape, risking her very life doing so, just as instictual, just as or more readily as a woman will love her baby regardless of his paternity. THANK GOD for preventive measures such as "the morning after pill" that can induce a woman's period BEFORE the act produces a zygot....which is pre-embrio.
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Post by cookiemonster on Aug 6, 2010 18:53:35 GMT -5
I do not think that abortion should be permitted in cases of rape. It is not the baby's fault that he or she was conceived via rape.
I've seen such women interviewed on television, who got pregnant by rape. One woman who became pregnant due to rape kept her baby. Such a woman could always put the baby up for adoption.
Said remedios above, That is a bogus argument, a cheap shot, and a red herring.
Women are treated far worse in Islamic societies than they are in Judeo-Christian ones.
Judaism (and Christianity is an outgrowth of Judaism) bestowed legal rights to women in their originating culture, and the New Testament, males are instructed to treat women with respect and kindness.
Women in Islamic cultures today are still stoned to death for committing adultery. Their husbands, under sharia law, are permitted to mistreat them, beat them, and in some such nations, females are not allowed to attend school or drive cars.
In the guise of "honor killings," female rape victims in Islamic nations are put to death by Islamic authorities just for being rape victims.
remedios said, Exactly: this abortion debate is largely about "what women want."
Abortion is driven by selfishness. Thanks for inadvertently admitting it.
Goodness forbid that any woman sacrifice her career, her own ambitions, happiness or convenience for anyone else, including the human life growing inside of her.
A lot of liberal men support abortion because they want to be able to have as much 'no-strings attached' sex as they can without having to worry about the responsibilities of father hood, or not having to worry about making child support payments.
Some of those babies being killed are females, btw. You support women killing future women in the name of feminism, women's rights, or whatever? Strange.
remedios said The baby conceived did not have a choice in how he/she was conceived. He/she did not get to choose his/her father.
remedios said, I don't think most women get raped and get pregnant via rape.
I seriously doubt it's personally happened to you or that it will, so you're getting worked up over a hypothetical situation. So I've never really understood the outrage about the rape scenario.
Most studies I've seen mention that the vast majority of abortions carried out are on pregnancies that were conceived via consensual sex, not due to rape.
remedios said: You are arguing that two wrongs make a right.
This is also another form of selfishness: 'look what happend to me, look at my trauma. Me, me, me, meeeee!'
Why should another human being (i.e., the little baby growing inside you) have to be murdered to ease your mental pain or your stress?
I've seen interviews with rape victims who opted not to get abortions - I'm sure they went through hell, but they survived. They survived the rape, they survived carrying the rapist's baby. If they can do it, I'm sure you can, too.
The pro- abortion person said, Being traumatized does not legitimize the taking of a human life.
Does anyone here with a medical background know if a woman could be "knocked out" in some fashion and the baby be delivered via C-section, so that the rape victim would not even have to be awake during delivery?
remedios said: "If" you were raped.
And "If" you were raped and got pregnant by the rapist. It has not even happened to you.
So (by your reasoning) it should be legal for unborn babies everywhere to be killed because of a hypothetical fear you have.
remedios said: But going through the abortion procedure would still be a reminder.
If giving birth to the rapist's baby, however..
For the few hours or minutes you would in labor, perhaps you'd be reminded of the rape; but then the baby gets handed off to adoptive parents right after the kid pops out, and you never has to see the kid ever again.
You're arguing that a baby has to be murdered in the womb to spare a woman a few hours of mental stress in a hospital delivery room. That's a pretty extreme way of dealing with a situation.
remedios said: But why doesn't the unborn baby get a choice about what happens to him or her?
chaMur said: That comment was directed at someone else, but I wanted to add that I am a female.
However, I do not see any logical (or other compelling reason) why a male cannot argue against the immorality of murder, which is what abortion amounts to.
I find it ironic that women who argue so passionately in favor of abortion don't seem to care that abortion is tantamount to the murder of females - it's not always male babies who are aborted.
Coben said, You're kind of mixing apples and oranges.
This thread was talking about should a woman be legally permitted to abort a baby that was conceived via rape.
I'm not a pacifist. Sometimes war is necessary. If it weren't, genocidal maniacs like Hitler would rule the world.
Sometimes, unfortunately, civilians are killed in cross fire during war (including unborn babies who die when the mother carrying them get killed), but that fact does not magically make abortion on demand ethical or acceptable.
Coben said: It depends on the military action we're talking about, the circumstances.
If some unborn babies were accidentally killed by allied forces trying to shoot at Nazi Germans to free the Jews and Europeans, that is sad, but should we regret that the Nazis were defeated?
Should Americans just have sat that war out and said, "Hey, we'll let Hitler take over Europe, keep killing Jews, homosexuals and gypsies, because darn it, one of our guys might accidentally shoot and kill a pregnant woman!"
Said alaskan sheliah: That still does not justify a rape victim aborting her baby, though.
And clearly, since some rape victims do choose to carry to term and give birth, it's not an absolute, across the board reaction by all women.
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